Taking a close look at doping control in professional tennis. How stringent is it? We also look at other issues related to the integrity of the sport.
Charlie Hebdo takes a provocative approach to #tennis too. Seen at Roland Garros today pic.twitter.com/FEFP6MgAuZ— Christopher Clarey (@christophclarey) May 29, 2015
Charlie Hebdo takes a provocative approach to #tennis too. Seen at Roland Garros today pic.twitter.com/FEFP6MgAuZ
The trenchant pens of Charlie Hebdo have turned their eye to tennis on their cover this week... (h/t @Ubitennis) pic.twitter.com/J59e1v9Cbz— Ben Rothenberg (@BenRothenberg) May 29, 2015
The trenchant pens of Charlie Hebdo have turned their eye to tennis on their cover this week... (h/t @Ubitennis) pic.twitter.com/J59e1v9Cbz
Good to see!
It's pretty damn obvious that it's Nadal on the front cover. Anything to get people talking about doping in tennis I'm all for.
Question:did they also publish a satirical front page on doping in French rugby?Answer:no, they didn't!!Here are some facts:Rugby, where are your values?A player breaks omertaLaurent BénézechBénézech Laurent tells his fight against the corrupted system, supports documents, denounces the practices that drive French rugby to a destructive leak for the cult of absolute performance....http://www.amazon.com/Rugby-o%C3%B9-sont-tes-valeurs-ebook/dp/B00QJBQ4CCBest regards.Fabrice
Justin Gatlin makes my blood boil....... https://youtu.be/2lWtF6uLnMc
Serena just gets stronger as the match goes on. Azarenka had no chance in the fifth, one just knew it instinctively. At 33 and a half her strength, stamina and tirelessness, against someone not yet 26, is quite astonishing. Don't you think, journalists?
Indeed if evr tested and positive would b covrd up to protect the sport. What a scourge of a world we now live in
Nadal is at his merciless best yet again. I'd be surprised if gluten free Nole in the form of his life, or the new Murray Clay edition stop him. 'God' help age defying Federer if they he was to meet the pumped up matador.
Watching Nadal play his latest match we can see the huge power and speed are definitely coming back. In such form he looks unstoppable once again. Yet this is a player who was abe to win only one tournament in the twelve months since his last French Open title. Despite his worst ever lead-up to the French Open a record tenth title now beckons. Do we really need any other proof of his massive doping? Charlie Hebdo are spot on the mark. The sport is clearly corrupt. J'accuse.
Djokovic's regime looks perfectly up to the task. Hitting all the lines.
Nadal has dropped a set and I have no idea how. He looked imperious in the first two. I don't think even Djokovic's regime at this point would be sufficient to stop Nadal firing on all cylinders, although he may not have to face that Nadal.
As usual since a decade, Nadal's great doping team allowed him to be at his very best form during the French open.
Serena is actually more dominant today at 33 years old then she was 10 years ago at 23 years old and tennis media just act as though it's natural. This is someone who was complaining about an elbow injury a couple of weeks ago. It's ludicrous that she gets zero speculation about her miraculous recovery skills.Both Nadal and Djokovic are playing as if they are unbeatable. Tomorrow's match will be interesting to say the least. Whose doping regimen works better - Nadal's or Djoker's?
Steroid Williams just blasted thru her much younger quarterfinal opponent losing only 4 games on her worst surface.Just another day in the farce that has become women's tennis!
"Watching Nadal play his latest match we can see the huge power and speed are definitely coming back."Lol, ok.Nadal is playing clean, you idiots. That's his normal level.
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Breaking News!!!"Dope Once, Test Positive for Life"Research suggests artificial muscle enhancers stick with cheating athletes for life. So will we see lifetime bans for first-time cheats?...http://www.outsideonline.com/1982176/dope-once-test-positive-lifeBest regards.Fabrice1PS ITF, ATP and WDA will give them lots of money to make it as soon as possible!!2PS obviously, it was an ironic gag!!
I hate sounding paranoid, but is anybody else a little bit skeptical of Timea Bacsinszky's rise in the rankings over the last 12 months? I have checked her WTA profile and she has been a pro since 2004 and in 10 years on the tour, she never even cracked the top 50 in the rankings. At this time last year, she was ranked 112 and now next week, she will be ranked inside the top 20. One thing I have noticed about her is that she seems to be very gifted physically. After she won the tournaments in Monterrey and Acapulco back-to-back, many punters expected her to flame out in Indian Wells due to "fatigue", but instead she won 3 3-set matches in a row and was only stopped by Serena Williams in the quarterfinals. Hm, ...
You should know her dramatic personal story before being paranoid about her!!“I have a father who put me in a cage,” Timea Bacsinszky opens up about her childhood https://tennistranslations.wordpress.com/2015/03/19/i-have-a-father-who-put-me-in-a-cage-timea-bacsinszky-opens-up-about-her-childhood-interviewed-by-flaberne/Best regards.FabricePS if she was a "cute face" ( most people like her!! I don't!! She is a sort of plastified Barbie for my personal taste!! ) like Eugenie Bouchard, would ever be paranoid about her?Answer: No, never!!
The amount of spin and velocity Nadal is able to put into his forehand shots is simply staggering. His court coverage looks pretty much impenetrable as well. Djokovic on the other hand once again looks like he has nothing left up his sleeve. Nadal's juice is still king of the hill, by the looks of it.
A sweaty Nadal reminds me of a fake tanned hulk hogan from the 80's. Funny that. Nadal is doing most of the legwork even though Djokovic has just won the first.
Nadal is getting waxed now. Guess when you've been doping for so long your regimen loses its effectiveness. Welcome to our new doping overlord/king Novak Djokovic!Please let Murray, Tsonga or Wawrinka win the French.
Djokovic's level was unreal. While some of it is due to his improvements in serving and style of play, there were too many ridiculous points to ignore. The Djokovic of 2010 and before would have lost this match from going for too much while Nadal made great defense, there is clearly a difference in this version.
Djokovic basically grinding down Nadal.
Djokovic's trouncing of Nadal was to be expected, IMO. I didn't see a lot of Nadal at this year's French Open, but the little bit I saw against Jack Sock did not impress me. He was too up and down with his play and made many unforced errors. I don't know if Nadal is trying to get by without peds now or if his doping regime has simply lost it's effectiveness, but whatever it is, he has become a mere shadow of his former self.
Not surprised either (as I, too, saw most of the Jack Sock match) and I am thinking the same: is he playing without PEDs or is the regimen just not as effective nowadays? The next act should be quite fascinating: he'll go big or go home. Either he goes for one last hurrah (i.e. an ambitious new doping regimen) or he'll retire. I don't see him playing for too long if he basically becomes a floater.
"is he playing without PEDs or is the regimen just not as effective nowadays?"Of course it's the former. Why would his regime be less effective?
I figure he'll go big. Tío Toni's got an Ahab-like obsession with Federer and he won't let his nephew stop until he's broken Federer's Grand Slam record.They'd rather risk killing him with megadoses of his usual regimen (or even maybe some nasty experimental shit) than let it go. He'll start foaming at the mouth on court, turn yellow and green, bleed from his ears, rage out at the umps, and the commenters will gush about what a "warrior" and "champion" he is. Such is modern tennis.
Tommy: who knows, there seems to have been notable differences in the doping regimen's effectiveness (intended or not) over the years. The 2010 US Open 140 MPH serve came out of nowhere only to never be seen again. (That being said, it raised quite a few eyebrows and the different grip rationale didn't convince a lot of people, so maybe they had to tone it down a bit as to not to appear too unnatural - remember that he was then gunning for his first USO title, so they probably went all out just to secure it.)
He had an improved service motion. It's no lie, there is a video of him fixing it. The guy that taught him is some guy called Oscar something something.Maybe he added roids too, but there was a real change of technique involved, no question.
Usually Djokovic-Nadal encounters drive up traffic to this blog, but this time it didn't. What an anticlimax! An aging doper being beaten handily by a younger, stronger doper.Wonder what Uncle Toni has in store to try to give his nephew an extra boost. The Nadal family cash cow is down to #10 in the world now, #11 if Tsonga makes the final. Better come up with something fast.
Never change, Rafael:“In general, Novak was in control most of the time. He was better than me -- that’s it. It's simple, when an opponent plays better than you, he’s in better shape than you. It happens. Just congratulate him. I was doubtful about myself.”Now his fans will cling to the "better shape" angle as if Nadal is telling them he is hurt when, in reality, he just layed off the PEDs some.
Murray vs Ferrer is going to a 4th set... wearing each other down.Ferrer is a pretty good grinder at 33 years old!Djokovic will make mincemeat of either one at this rate.
Doping allegations against Mo Farah's coach...http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-32877702
Very powerful documentary.............Lots of talk of micro doping, which should educate people. http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b05zhqvk/panorama-catch-me-if-you-can
Although according to UK athletics there is nothing to see here. No concerns about Farah at all. Odd that Salazar would dope everyone BUT the runner who is the fastest.http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/athletics/33034350It is just like Armstrong all over again.
If anyone needed more evidence of how in the tank the media is for Steroid Williams, check out this article:http://ftw.usatoday.com/2015/06/first-take-espn-french-open-tennis-serena-williamsThe author "weeps for society" and finds it "inexplicable" that he was able to find some folks on twitter who were unhappy when bonus coverage of Williams 4th round match preempted the start of First Take on ESPN2.
V.Williams is playing amazingly well now for a supposed "ill" player
I meant Serena of course, not Venus.
10 games in a row in a slam semifinal on her worst surface after trailing 6-4, 3-2! Move along nothing to see here.
I honestly can't believe that people are still falling for Serena's bullshit. It was pretty remarkable how Serena was "hurting" between points, yet she had no problems running down her opponent's shots during the rallies. Not once did I believe that Serena was going to lose the match when watching it.
Looks like there's going to be a double Calendar Slam in tennis this year.
"Serena overcomes flu, rallies into French final"The media is killing me, lol!
Yes, the whole coughing scenario was outrageous. I've played tennis at a relatively high level and I can say for sure that if you were coughing that hard on a changeover, you most probably would be between long exchanges on court, because that's when you'd suck in air the most. What bullshit. I can't take watching Serena anymore. The biggest drama queen of all.As for double calendar slam, I'm not sure. I have a feeling Djokovic will come unstuck at some point, but Serena definitely seems on her way. If however Djokovic achieves it, I would love to see if there will be a lull towards the end of the season, a la 2011.
First Take is utter trash but so is Steroid Serena and her run to another Slam title.Serena faking the flu now in case she loses. Elbow, flu, etc. I doubt she's losing to Safarova, but if she does, look for the excuses and "I was sick" speak to come through loud clear. I'll be shocked if Safarova wins 5 games tomorrow.Novak and Serena racing through their fields at decimating levels. And tennis powers-that-be wonder why tennis ratings are the lowest they've been in years.
To be fair it is chris chase, a man sacked by Yahoo for being awful.
Any thoughts on these repeated super slow starts and killer finishes for Serena? I can't quite figure out what she is doing or taking that explains the pattern.
That's 4 matches out of 6 she dropped the first set (in this case she was also down a break in the 2nd).Wait till she's down a set and a break, then take something during the side change?
The law of diminishing returns. It's become too easy and the straight forward wins give lower and lower highs each time. So instead, to achieve the desired buzz she needs to manufacture some drama and bask in all the adulation.
"The law of diminishing returns. It's become too easy and the straight forward wins give lower and lower highs each time. So instead, to achieve the desired buzz she needs to manufacture some drama and bask in all the adulation."I see I'm not the only one who's thinking that Serena throws sets on purpose from time to time to give herself a challenge. That's good to know.
I think that we can all agree on one thing: she'll die at a young age, Flo Jo style.
Serena sucks on clay.
FloJo came out of nowhere improving times in days and weeks not months and years setting Olympic records in the process.We all knew she was juicing just like Ben Johnson in 88 when he smashed the 100 meter record.Who were these people before? They were not even on the radar.Serena has always been an elite athlete winning the US Open at 17 beating Graf at Indian Wells and Hingis in the Open.She has always been built like a brickhouse,missed 3 or 4 years with illness,injury and her sister"s murder so she is 29 or 30 in Tennis years ending points early her whole career adding years to her career.If you support Serena she is clean,if you do not she is a user.We as alleged fans don"t know anything only who we like and hate.So why play judge and jury on a champion athlete.Look at Lebron,he is superhuman after playing 45 or 50 thousand minutes at that level in 12 years.Where are the accusations for him?His recovery time is astonishing and ability to compete at that level year after year is rare.Just enjoy the greatness,it is a privilege to watch it.
Stan the Animal certainly is a late bloomer...
Even if Stan is on the deuce, I must admit that I enjoyed watching him and Tsonga play. It reminded me of a game I used to know called tennis. Certainly much more than this current match does.
Djokovic is as bad as Serena. 3-3 0-30 calls the doctor with head dizziness and then wins 11 of next 12 to take set.
It's amazing how often the announcers describe Djokovic's performance as unbelievable...you would think they might reflect on their own words.
While nothing is set in stone yet, it looks more likely he's facing Djokovic on Sunday. I just want Wawrinka to win if he faces Djokovic. Anything else is an atrocity for tennis.
After the Lance Armstrong stuff came out, cycling fans and even some journalists began to feel comfortable talking about off the charts performance as evidence of doping. We can't seem to ever get there in tennis so we watch these almost frightening performances and use words like unreal, unbelievable, unheard of and act like we can't see the things that are right in front of our noses.Delete
I think the problem in the media clearly it's knowledge, experts like Jim Courier must know that doping goes on, the problem is they're too afraid to speak out, perhaps rightly so. Public reaction to the Mo Farah incident here in the UK does show the naivety of the public towards doping in sport, the amount of people I've heard say, " how didn't Mo realise?" Is ridiculous, considering all evidence points towards him being Invovled in doping. That being said journalists writing articles saying stuff along the lines of "you never know what your training partners are up to" doesn't help the perception of doping in sport.
But it is much the same as with Armstrong. There were people who up until his confession refused to believe that he doped.No one likes to see their heroes revealed to have feet of clay.
The Charlie Hebdo image - drugs for the back, knee, and two biceps - they are clearly referencing Nadal with the exception of the fact that the player in the image is right handed. They might have to come up with a new cartoon next year at this rate.
How can you tell the player is right-handed? I think that's why they put both hands on the racquet so that it wouldn't be so obvious whether he's right or left-handed. I think the headband and the sweat are a dead giveaway that it's Nadal.
Yet again Murray left with nothing in the tank in the final set and Djoko looks ready to go on all day.
Who's betting that our Novak will show no tiredness signs when he takes on Stan despite intense grand slam tennis for the third day in a row. Would love to see Stan win but on clay, as opposed to Aus or US, he is too far behind him to cause an upset. Novak has the (real) Grand Slam in his sights.
So many triumphant moments (like Safarova & Murray nearly had today) robbed from their opponents by Serena, Djokovic, and Nadal. I can't believe Safarova couldn't finish it off, from how the match was looking with Safarova up 2-0 in the third set, but what did I expect when it involves Williams. It's not that these cheats wouldn't have won some Grand Slams without PEDs, but how much they unfairly deny the others from their much deserved Championships.
Well said. This is my major gripe too. All these moments lost through cheating. And its robbing fans of a more competitive and thrilling era. One day we'll all look back and think what could have been.
How do you know they'd win ANY SLAMS without PEDs?As far as I'm concerned if someone is a cheat, every result in their entire career is suspect. We sure as hell can't rely on the drug testers and the authorities to set things straight. We can only go on our own instincts.
I know what you mean and I don't disagree with you much at all. I just think it's hard to say 100% for sure that these athletes have never played "fair and square". With Serena Williams, I believe she likely did win a few of her early Grand Slams without PEDs at least. Because you can see the difference in her body then and now, as well as the way she has been acting on court and playing. And a lot of the suspicious things that have happened with her have been in recent years only, like the incident where she had an embolism and the other incident where she hid from testers. And it just makes sense, since she is getting older now and needs those PEDs to keep her "edge" over the competition. With Djokovic, he won the 2008 Australian Open at a time when he was still having stamina problems. It was the sudden disappearance of those stamina problems that led a lot of people to question whether he was on PEDs or not. So maybe he got that first one "fair and square". I don't know about Nadal, but I'm sure some others could offer an opinion on that. But also, just from watching these players, it's obvious that they are talented at the sports that they play. Even with the PEDs, if they had really bad aim or ate really poorly or didn't put in any time training, they would lose even while taking PEDs. And they do lose from time to time as it is, so PEDs do not work 100% anyway. So, as much as I hate to say it, I personally think they'd probably still be Champions, but they'd have dramatically fewer Championships. I think Serena Williams would be done playing now for several years without PEDs, and her up and down quality of play/physical condition over the past few years is clearly due to PEDs. I thought she was finished after Wimbledon 2013, but unfortunately she somehow was able to keep it up nearly 2 more years. Then there's the fact that tennis authorities do such a terrible job testing for PEDs and enforcing the rules against PEDs, that it's likely more tennis players take PEDs to some extent than are totally clean. It's probably the case that players feel they have to take them to some extent to have any chance of keeping up with the rest. With that in mind, I doubt anyone will ever fully be stripped of their Championships or have asterisks put next to their names in record books. Because for all we know, *everyone* is taking PEDs and the results are actually fair. I don't think that's the case, but I was just saying that to illustrate a point. So, for me, I think Williams, Djokovic, and Nadal probably would've won a few Grand Slams anyway, but wouldn't have been anywhere near this dominant without PEDs. I see your point though... If this all eventually comes out to the public and it's certain 100% that they have been on PEDs, I don't know where I would officially draw the line and maybe you would have to just completely dismiss all of their achievements. It's a much more complex issue than a lot of people realize. Sorry for saying "PEDs" so much, but I have gotten a little tired of saying "steroids" because I think most of the cheating probably doesn't really actually involve steroids themselves but other types of PEDs instead.
Both Williams sisters were always known for their "power game" going back to the very beginning of their career. They beat opponents because they hit the ball harder than everyone else. And their constant grunting sounds have always sounded more male than female to me going back to the very beginning of their careers (more so than any other females on tour).If you count doubles titles the Williams sisters have won no less than 44 slam titles now (20 singles for Serena, 7 for Venus, 13 doubles, 2 each in mixed). And that doesn't even count the Olympics.Sure Serena may be taking more potent cocktails of drugs now (probably the most of any active female in sports) but I find it hard to believe that any of their 44 slam titles were legitimate.
Even the great Maria Sharapova has won only 5 slams in her long career. Kim Clijsters and Martina Hingis also won 5 slams. Justine Henin won 7, but no doubles slams and her career was far shorter. Monica Seles won 9 but the last of those came 19 years ago.So the question one must ask themselves, is what are the odds that the 2 most successful female tennis players of our generation would BOTH come from the same family?Sure there are many sports where siblings both participate but never with anywhere near this level of success.The odds seem astronomical to me.
dave, you're a fucking retard. You couldn't reason your way out of a wet paperbag.Venus is nowhere near as successful as her sister. There is absolutely no evidence that she didn't win any slam without PEDs. Just on what drug was she in 2007?
Dave, It is not their fault. It is called genetics.
The great Maria Sharapova??? lol
Ben Johnson, Marion Jones, Dwayne Chambers, Justin Gaitlin - a long line of athletes with a "genetic" advantage. Oh, I forgot - a 54 year old tennis player called Serena Williams.@Tommy AssActually, Dave's reasoning is quite persuasive. You, on the other hand, are clearly genetically disadvantaged. Quite tragic, really.
Lance Armstrong was more believable.
Djokovic and Williams outlast opponents on clay, and barely a ripple here..... Unfortunately, even the fans who are most passionate about doping seem to be getting jaded at this point.
I suspect less people are watching the matches now. This site has been going for several years now and the cheating only gets worse. It's not like people's comments here do anything to change the sport.At a certain point you throw up your hands in the air and just move on to watching other things on TV.
I know I watch far less tennis nowadays, so I suspect you have a point... I do think, though, that every reasonable but skeptical post about doping in tennis is important, whatever the forum, ... It keeps the pressure on, and reminds the journos and officials that not all the fans are willing to drink the Kool-Aid. I have seen a sea-change in attidues of fans over the years, from a point where even suggesting that doping could be an issue drew universal wrath, to the current situation where most fans seem to realize that there is a problem.
I keep telling myself that I am done with tennis but I keep getting pulled back in. But if Wawrinka doesn't win tomorrow I am 99% sure I am done for good. The sport is at rock bottom as far as I'm concerned.
Well my only hope is that eventually the rampant cheats will be caught and their reputations ruined. Lance Armstrong thought he had got away with it, as did Sepp Blatter. It all comes out eventually. Many of the comments in the media today are calling Djokovic out on his cheating. I am starting to wonder if Federer will be the one to spill the beans when he retires. That there is a doping problem in tennis hasn't been in doubt for years. Eventually something will happen to open the whole can of worms. Just like it is looking as though it is about to happen for Mo Farrah.
Tennis is such a closed sport though - probably even more closed off than soccer (if that's possible). I wish I was optimistic that we get a whistleblower or some hacker who decides to use their skills for good and hacks into ATP/WTA/ITF and doping control e-mails to expose the cheating, but I'm not holding my breath.
Serena Williams played during the same era as Steffi Graf, Monica Seles, Lindsay Davenport, Mary Pierce, Arantxa Sanchez Vicario, and Jennifer Capriati. She has managed to outlast her contemporaries including her own sister (a shadow of her former self), Justine Henin, Kim Clijsters, Amelie Mauresmo, and Martina Hingis. At nearly 34 years old, she is dominated players who should be in their prime.
Serena is actually more dominant now than she was during her "Serena Slam" time. And this is a woman who claims to have an elbow injury, the flu, and a sore neck, or whatever ailment she is always claiming she has. I think the only injury she hasn't claimed to have is a yeast infection (although I'm sure that's next).Yet she has the stamina to have multiple three-set matches without getting tired and gets stronger as the match goes on. It's amazing that so tennis has so many sickly athletes who are Grand Slam winners. I don't think there's another sport where so many of the athletes moan about how they are practically on their deathbed yet can play 3+ hour matches and not break a sweat.
It's true. SO many players are playing possum at every given opportunity yet appear unscathed. It is almost as bad as soccer stars exaggerating or fabricating almost every single ounce of 'pain' caused by a challenge, only to get up once the referee has had none of it and proceed to run around like an uninhibited maniac for the rest of the 90 minutes.
I thought the outcry will be unmatched after Serena's sweet 20th title but alas. I am very disappointed in the haters and expect them to be better in the future which can be in the next few weeks or so. Until then, keep working on your hating skills
Serena 'Panic Room' Williams is still assumed to be extremely suspicious of PED abuse for a long, long list of reasons, don't you worry.
A long list of illogical reasons
Quite logical actually, but I'm sure you knew that and are just deliberately being annoying.
I am honest when I say they are illogical. If you read the remaining of my postings on this page, you will see my concerns against your arguments. Most of the arguments made against Serena don't fall in place.
Djokovic is looking fit as a fiddle on this third day in a row of playing.
John McEnroe just said Novak Djokovic "never gets tired." with no irony.
He's looking a little tired now, Or Stan is just playing better.
I expect Djokovic to close out the last two sets 6-3, 6-1.
The only way this whole shit is going to stop is if they speed up the courts and use lighter balls.
so happy I was wrong...
Djokovic is getting nervous, his beloved career slam is on the line here. However now that Stan has a chance he is playing nervously in the fourth. I also expect Djokovic to win the last two easily enough. As though he has had a 3 day rest!
The last time someone beat Nadal in the French Open, he lost to a Swiss guy in the final.
Wow, victory for beautiful tennis today! Wawrinka bossed Djokovic around and broke his will.
Lol. That was impossibly good tennis from Stan, made Djokovic look powerless.
Excellent win for tennis. I think Djokovic wanted it so much he got nervous and Wawrinka's backhand was unreal today.
I have to admit, that was fun.
That's the most fun I've had watching a match in ages. If there was a winner today, it was the game of tennis.
And what makes you think Wawrinka, like any other top player, can't also be doping?
I think it's possible that every player in the top 25 is doping and it may be our hero or villain who gets caught. There are certain players who seem to have more performance indicators but none of us really know. My guess is that the full truth will break hearts among a diverse range of fans. I still had great fun watching Stan win today!
Hahaha, how WONDERFUL to see "THE DJUICER'S" roided dreams come crashing down.......
> And what makes you think Wawrinka, like any other top player, can't also be doping?I think it's very possible he is. While Warwinka's offense has gotten most of the attention, his defense may have been even more remarkable. He easily ran down a number of balls I thought would be winners or at least unreturnable. He was just gliding and sliding effortlessly around the court, despite a tough battle in very hot conditions a couple days before. Pretty impressive for a 30-year-old. When it came down to it, I couldn't detect either player having more in his legs, Wawrinka was just hitting missiles with laser-guided precision, while Djokovic looked like he just couldn't handle either the pace or the moment. Ultimately, I don't see this as an obvious victory for "clean" tennis, but is is a defeat for a suspect player who has been disturbingly dominant all year. For that reason at least, I'm pleased.
Agreed on all counts.
Agree with this completely.
Wawrinka was very likely to be doped. I haven't seen such sustained hitting for so long in a match, against someone as good at defense as gluten free Nole. He was making a lot of amazing shots deep into rallies and from pretty impossible positions at times.More talented he may be, but just for the sake of objectivity, I don't think that was a clean victory or that tennis was the winner in the end.
When you are watching a match what constitutes a clean tennis player.Not making great shots in long rallies.Hasn't every great player that ever lived made great shots from impossible positions.The people on this site should not watch any matches.Who is not juicing?Since you have so much insight into who is,tell me who isn't.
@dtank77,In the case of Stan, it's that he never mounted much of a challenge to the top players until recently. It's certainly possible he improved his fitness and confidence through good ol' fashioned hard work, better coaching, etc. I genuinely hope that is the case, but given his age, I'm just not confident it's the case.
I'm just happy to get beyond "tennis dynasties" like players winning a grand slam 10 times or collecting 20 titles as if their chicken nuggets.
How can you be a sports fan if every time your player loses the other player has to be using peds?Champions are born with an intangible that you or I will never have.When it it is all said and done Serena will go down in history as the greatest tennis player of all time male or female and not one comment on any forum will take that from her.
That's what Lance Armstrong's fans used to say about their hero.
Like I said no comment on any forum will take that from her and Lance Armstrong is nowhere near Serena Williams in any way shape or form.The level of scandal surrounding him is like FIFA.They didn't target test him despite all the evidence that was piling up.They let him slide then they took him down because they had no choice.Let me explain something if you come to my house at 6 in the morning and I don't know you,shit is popping off.If you were Serena Williams why would you expect a man at 6 in the morning to be a drug tester instead of a lunatic.She was tested 10 times lasted year.Venus 10 and Sloane Stephens 6, you think there might be some racial profiling there.Do you understand she was blowing serves and groundstrokes by Graf and Hingis when she was 17?Armstrong is a bum,that is his legacy.Serena is a game changing role model champion.That is why you see so many promising young American female tennis players and that is why you see so many women with great serves and powerful groundstrokes these days.Go overdose on your haterade.
Was LiNa doping too?She became a world class player at 30.What constitutes a clean tennis player to you? Are you serious? Stan ran down some balls and now he is on steroids.That guy always had more power from both sides than anyone else best backhand maybe ever and now because he wins 2 slams late in his career he is suspect.You should never watch a tennis match because you can not appreciate the work it takes to be a champion.Is every great player a suspect? You have no clue as to how hard you have to work to achieve success and if you work hard but don't have the talent get out of the game and stop hating the players that are better than you.
No fan ever believes their heroes could be doping. You are no different. Quite simply, you wouldn't have a clue.
> Stan ran down some balls and now he is on steroids.@dtank77,The people who run the drug testing program for tennis are visibly and demonstrably incompetent if not corrupt. Some players have made a quantum leap in their ability to recover from a five-set match compared with players of just 10-15 years ago. Some players are having tremendous success, sometimes out of nowhere, above the age of 30. Some players have the same ebbs and flows in their performance every year, which can't be explained by surface. Some players have claimed to be suffering from recurring, chronic, normally lifelong injuries for a number of years, then abruptly ceased mentioning that injury. Some players have close associations with certain shady characters known to be involved in doping.These things are red flags. Any one of them doesn't prove that anyone is doping. Even all of them together don't prove anyone is doping. What the they do is cast a giant shadow of doubt over professional tennis. The intent of this forum, as I see it, is to get people to consider the very real possibility that the same thing that happened in cycling is now happening in tennis.Obviously, assertions about who is or is not doping are based on circumstantial evidence, but when you consider that the tennis testing program is neither independent nor transparent and has a history of sweeping the positive test results of big-name players under the carpet to protect the reputation of the sport (a la Agassi), no player is above suspicion. So when I say I'm not confident that Wawrinka is clean, I'm not hating (he seems like a good guy, and I like the way he hits the ball quite a lot, in fact), I'm expressing my skepticism. It's not about convincing anyone that Wawrinka is guilty or trying to bring him down, it's about getting people to realize that the system is broken, and if players being to perceive that they can only compete by doping, many of them will dope.
"Some players have made a quantum leap in their ability to recover from a five-set match compared with players of just 10-15 years ago."What is your opinion on Edberg victory at the 1992 US open?
@Julien B,I don't recall watching it, but you're right, that's a pretty damn impressive string of matches right there (http://www.atpworldtour.com/Tennis/Players/Ed/S/Stefan-Edberg.aspx?t=pa&y=1992&m=s&e=0#). Just out of curiosity, I thought I'd compare his total time on court to Nadal's at the 2012 Australian Open (http://www.atpworldtour.com/Tennis/Players/Top-Players/Rafael-Nadal.aspx?t=pa&y=2012&m=s&e=0#). Nadal was on court 4 minutes longer across 7 matches, so not much difference there, especially given how much time Nadal spends toweling off and dislodging his shorts from various orifices. The real difference, of course, is that Edberg is one of the great serve and vollyers of all times, while Nadal wins his points the hard way (by running a lot). So, I have a hunch Nadal expended somewhat more energy. Still, you definitely raise a good counterpoint.
Thanks for your detailed answer. I was just wondering when massive doping started in Tennis. It may be much earlier than we think. Edberg was always one of my favorite player but his amazing performance at the 1992 edition of the US open seems kind of suspicious retrospectively.
Edberg in 1992, Becker in 1996, Sampras in 2002 (my idol btw), Agassi in his later years, Federer in his later years. The system has never been good - and everyone in this list is suspect. Perhaps not as egregious as Nadal/Serena/Djokovic but still a possibility.
I am an Arod fan and he still might be doping.He is not my hero and Serena is not my hero either.I am too old for that shit but as far as greatness goes there is no one better and who the fuck are you to tell me I don't have a clue.What clue do you have other than your hate?Tell me what evidence do you or anybody else have that she or anyone else is doping.You have some nerve to accuse someone you don't know or know anything about of anything.You aint shit just like the rest of these racist haters on this site.
Your credibility falls when you brandish people who don't share your opinions as 'haters'.
Did this guy reply to anything I said? No,just insisted I have no clue comparing Serena to a known abuser.They exposed Armstrong.What proof do you or anyone else have that Serena,Nadal.Djoko,or anybody else failed a drug test?None,so if I ask you to give me proof and you have none then you must be a jealous resentful hater.What other reason would you say that?And if a purely objective person read his posts and my replies,I guarantee Richard would be the one with no credibility.And as far as the word brandish what are you doing when you call champion athletes ped users.Look in the mirror.
@dtank77:How adorable. Which are you - sad, deluded, bootlicking fan or a member of Serena's management team? I ask because the crap you're spouting comes straight out of the mouth of every PR agent who claims their client is a saint and every rabid, obsessed fan who foams at the mouth when anyone dares calling out their hero as a fraud. You sound like every Lance Armstrong, A-Rod, Marion Jones, Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens fan who screams bloody murder at those who rightly tell you the emperor has no clothes.News flash, people are allowed to think Serena is doping. Just as you are allowed to think she isn't doping. It's called freedom of speech.
Serena is 33 and all her (former) contemporaries are retired or total has-beens. Yet she is winning slams with more ease than ever, by beating all her young opponents by grinding them down and outlasting them physically. Throw into the mix the mysterious foot injury supposedly from glass in a Munich restaurant (which the German media, despite their best efforts, have never been able to track down) and the panic room incident, and to call her 'suspicious' suddenly becomes an understatement! And you think you can scare us off by labelling us 'racist'?! Think again. We ain't going anywhere.
Honestly, regarding the foot injury? I still don't know how that can have anything to do with doping. She may have lied about the cause of the foot injury but for that to have anything to do with doping is another story. She lies all the time. It doesn't mean she is doping. People who are direct and honest have difficulty lying,
Delay tactics for cycling or a TUE acquisition are but two examples.
I want accurate examples not vague ones. I don't know of any delay tactic Serena used and if she did obtain a TUE, you can't automatically attribute them to doping.
Neither am I and one more time she will take her place as the greatest female athlete and greatest tennis player of all time despite what the KKK on this forum has to say.Both our opinions mean absolutely nothing.History will tell the story.
Doping tells her story. Actually, I am in favour of performance-enhancing drugs. For intelligence. You would stand to gain a lot.
If doping tells her story then being a dope tells your story.
How can it be racial when there is more Nadal hatred on here than anything? I can only speak for myself, but I think many more than just Serena are doping. I think Nadal and Djokovic are doping. I think it's disgusting Cilic and Troicki are playing as if nothing happened and I wouldn't be surprised if both were still doping. I find it mind-boggling that scumbag Odesnik was let back into the sport after trying to smuggle HGH. I think Sara Errani dopes and I think David Ferrer - an admitted chain smoker - dopes. Name me a chain smoker who has his stamina and physical fitness. I don't think tennis or the media has done anywhere near the legwork on the Operacion Puerto scandal or the Dr, del Moral scandal. It was an issue for a week or so and the media went back to not caring. I think the vast majority of Top 100 men and women are doping - white and black included. I think it's a joke that players can skip tests and basically get a slap on the wrist when other sports consider it a positive result if you skip or refuse a test. If Serena was white I'd have the same suspicions and would be calling her out just the same. If this was Sam Stosur who won 20 Slams you can better bet that I and everyone here would have MAJOR suspicions about how she is on steroids (and I personally think she is or was).It has nothing to do with race and everything to do with the fact that people are cheating to win and getting rewarded for it.
Guys, don't worry about the social justice warrior-type "race-baiters", they're just trolling.
If you beat me 6-2,6-1 today and a month later I beat you the same score and then I win a slam would you say I was on peds.I don't understand the logic.Serena has been great since she was 17.What is God-given to me is not to you or vice versa so why even bother assuming drugs.Just accept defeat and focus on your game.No one on any tennis site has any proof of any doping only slinging arrows at people who bust their ass to be champions.Odesnik was flat out caught,he couldn't win with or without steroids.I say enjoy the tennis and if down the road shit pops off then you can make a judgment.
dtank77. I have been on this site for sometimes and what I can tell you is that the accusations against Serena don't have anything to do with her race. But again, I can't speak for all of them.
There are a couple of Serena supporters besides you and I on this site the rest my gut feeling tells me if it quacks like a duck it's a duck.Her greatness was evident at 17 when she beat Graf at IW and Hingis in the Open.She had 5 slams and a career slam at 21.She lost her focus when her sister was killed drifted in and out of the game until she realized how good she could be and her place in tennis history finally mattered to her and here she is at 20.She is 30 in tennis years not 34 because of the time she missed and all the 2 set romps with 2 and 3 shot points.Djoko couldn't even stay on the court,bitching and moaning all the time now he is an 8 time winner,Federer dominated in his mid 20's and Nadal couldn't win a slam other than clay until 2008 but Serena has been great since 17.She has the same power now she did 13 years ago.She and her sister single-handedly changed the game like LT changed football and Bill Russell changed basketball.That is pure greatness.In 55 years of watching all sports I have never seen an athlete with her skills and heart and that includes MJ.And as far as that panic room bullshit she is supposed to let a complete stranger in her house at 6 am.Get the fuck outta here.So with all due respect because you and I are Serena supporters,the vibe is obvious they just camouflage it by saying everybody is doing it.
Because you are so well-informed about Serena and the panic room incident you should know that under the ITF drug testing rules the player selects the time window under which they agree to be available to the testers if they should call. In Serena's case it was 6am. There is only one reason Serena panicked. Yep, you don't have a clue.
If they should call???. So because you say you are available at 0600 for testing, it means you should remember and know foe sure that someone who is disguised and can't be identified should be let in after the tennis season is over and no one is expecting to be tested? What difference would that make if Serena said she wasn't home. Why you guys always want to justify everything with doping as if there is no other explanation. Who in their right mind would be doping 3 months ahead of the beginning of a season knowing that players dope to train? What is a point for someone so dominant and who you called under-trained to be training while doping 3 months before the first competition. Do you guys know Serena had to deal with an intruder in the past. Why wouldn't she be worried?
Eric, this guy acts like he is on the testing committee.He doesn't know shit.I would bet every dime I have that Serena Williams never told anybody to come to her house at 6 in the morning.I told you it is racial believe me he is showing his true colors.He will say anything to prove his point.Show me one document that says Serena's window was 6am.We are getting caught up in some prejudiced bull shit.No more posting on this site.There is no tennis talk only hatred toward champion athletes.
Out of competition testing 4.4.2 timing is at the discretion of the ITF.Hey Richard read the rules you asshole.
http://www.itftennis.com/media/191926/191926.pdfInformation RequiredYou are required to notify the ITF of where you will be for every day of the forthcoming year (i.e. from 1 January until 31 December 2015). On a quarterly basis, you must provide us with the following information for each day during the following quarter that you are Out-of-Competition: The full address of the place where you will be residing overnight (e.g. home, hotel, etc.); The name and address of each location where you will train, work or conduct any other regular activity (e.g. school) as well as the usual time-frames for such activities. A 60-minute time slot and location between 0600 and 2300 where you will be available and accessible for testing, even if this means duplicating your Overnight Accommodation details.
So based on your theory, Serena hasn't doped since that panic room incident?
I mean, no one suggests the panic room incident is the only likely time that Serena has doped. But it does appear to be the only time she was frightened of getting caught. Forgot to take the masking agents.
Are Eric Edouard, Eric Ed, dTank77 and Boreman all the same person carrying on conversations with him(their?)selves? Inquiring minds want to know!
The KKK? Piss off, you wanker.
If the shoe fits wear it and what the the fuck is a neutral milk hotel wanker times ten.
There is a typical kind that doesn't accept reality for what it is and that always lives in denial and finds justifications for every little thing that doesn't go their way. Everyone knows if you weigh more, you have more power. But some people feel like they can afford to be extremely skinny to look attractive to men of their kind and still compete against those who are heavily built. Then when they lose, they cry all the long and accuse everything. But the truth of the matter is it doesn't change anything whether you complain or not. Without doping of her counterparts , Serena would have been more dominant. No panic room incident or foot injury would change a thing. As for the embolism, it was a direct result of the foot injury as documented by doctors. I am not making it up. But who needs truth when they can hide behind fallacies even though I do give them their entertaining values.
Sorry, Ed, entertaining as you are, she still dopes.
Richard with lower case r, if Serena dopes, she would not be having mental letdown. She would not be losing in so many early rounds of majors. She wouldn't be so expressive in her emotions. She would not be taking so long finding her range. She would not letting so many balls pass her without chasing them. She would not be gasping for air after few exchanges. I just didn't see the same signs from the machines types of players that Djokovic, Nadal, steffi graph, Federer amongs other have displayed.She seems to be the exact opposite and I wonder why.All the criteria associated with doping like speed, ability to run down balls, total absence of fatigue, very few injuries, extreme focus, etc can't be seen from Serena and I wonder why.
Without doping this past-her-physical prime overweight under-trained head-case prima donna wouldn't even be making finals at this stage of her career.
richard. No one is past his or her physical prime at 33. You may not be as athletic but you don't lose your physical strength that early.You have to acknowledge that since Gouglou Gagla has been her coach, Serena has been training more.Who do you expect to stop her. Safarova only knows how hit the ball in one direction depending on the position of her body. Her foot work is null so she almost always hits the ball cross court with respect to the position of her body. If I can predict her plays even though the final was the first time I remember seeing her play, how do you think queen Serena would feel about it?
You can predict where Nadal is going to hit the ball ninety per cent of the time. That doesn't stop him from beating just about everybody who isn't named Djokovic."Queen" Serena? That just about says it all. Total fan adulation.Look, why don't you admit to yourself that you only come here to argue her case because you are desperately afraid your hero might be a drug cheat, and your world would come apart if it was true. That probably goes for your pal Tankhead as well.
You didn't answer my questions though. Also, Nadal wouldn't be winning without so much his top spin and moon ball. Also Nadal has great footwork and incredible stamina and defense.
Maybe old stuff, i don´t know:"How I became a drug cheat athlete to test the system", By Mark Dalyhttp://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-32983932
It's connected to this documentary, which is a must see.............https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NLfbqqAEKwoHere is the written account describing how people connected to Nike Oregan allege that "Albuterol" Salazar was encouraging athletes to use prescription meds to improve performance.https://www.propublica.org/article/former-team-members-accuse-coach-alberto-salazar-of-breaking-drug-rules
Anyone who tries to justify Serena running to her panic room and refusing a drug test because a tester rings her buzzer at her designated time, by claiming that, well, of course she would run and hide away, some strange man is creeping around her gardens and/or home (which they don't do), then they really have scraped the bottom of the excuse barrel!
Where did you hear that Serena refused to take the drug test during that panic room incident? They claimed she didn't take the test. It doesn't mean she refused to take the test. Here is my question. Hasn't she doped since that panic room incident?For people to see Serena coughing and barely moving againt ba..ky and then claim she was faking it makes me think that there is not a whole lot if rationale behind these doping accusations
Serena didn't take the test because she claimed she thought the tester knocking on the front door was an attempted break-in. So she hid in "the panic room". (We all have one of those, right?) Hence she could subsequently claim that she hadn't actually refused a test, which would have incurred sanction under the ITF anti-doping rules.
What stopped the tester from testing her afterwards? Moreover Serena still had a chance to claim she wasn't home and get one strike for missed test. Why making her presence known in the first place. Also, what can justify someone doping right at the end of the season when the next match is 3months away?I actually wanted to promote you to Richard with an upper case R but I am very disappointed in your ability to make sense.
The tester is hardly going to obtain a sample while Serena remains hidden in the well-named panic room. Are you really that thick? The ITF has not responded to inquiries as to whether the tester returned later or if Serena subsequently offered to provide a sample (which likely means no in both cases.) Since you obviously know so little about doping you are clearly unaware that the off-season is a key time for players to boost. Yet less than 10 per cent of the ITF anti-doping budget goes on OOC testing. Discussing these issues with you is like talking to someone who still believes in Santa Claus.
Players dope when they are training and no player train at the end of seasons. Their bodies need rest. So it doesn't make any sense. It was just the off season. It was at the end of that specific season. No under-trained player dopes that early.Also, it is not because there is a lack of clarity about the panic room incident that you can just invent a scenario that suits your interest.
You could stick that designated time shit up your ass.Murray said they come at any hour unannounced.
It may have escaped your penetrating intellect that the whole point of out-of-competition testing is that it is unannounced. The testers don't ring up in advance and say, "hey dude, we are coming over so you better make sure you've taken your masking agents before we get there!" But under the whereabouts rule the player has to specify times when he or she will be available if they call so they don't waste time dropping by when Serena has gone to the opera. Under the rule Serena indicated to the testers she would be at home at 6am ( the earliest they can call) the day they rang the buzzer on her front door. But, hey, panic stations - the queen of dopers wasn't ready for them that day. Time to hit the floor. Like Lance and Travis Tygart did when the testers turned up for them.
Yes. Technically, though, the ITF can test a player any time, but in practice I suspect they only collect samples in the "whereabouts" hour specified by the player....... Otherwise, it's too logistically challenging. Rules are here. http://content.yudu.com/Library/A3e945/2015TennisAntiDoping/resources/index.htm?referrerUrl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.itftennis.com%2Fantidoping%2Fhome.aspx re:............"Time to hit the floor. Like Lance and Travis Tygart did when the testers turned up for them." I think you meant to type Tyler Hamilton, rather than Travis Tygart (the head of USADA,and Lance's arch nemesis!!). The thought of Tygart and Lance hitting the floor together, when the testers came calling made my day :)
You are quite right! Tygart only would have hit the floor to take better aim. Thanks for the correction!
You have an answer for everying with no proof whatsoever.Why don't you answer that question?Listen you hide behind this site talking shit.Tell me how ignorant I am to my face.You can come to my house any day call me on my phone and lets see what kind of discussion we have then.All of these drug abusers had known associations.You can't hide shit nowadays,after all these years not one shred of evidence only internet gossip.All of these tennis haters on this site should get slapped upside their head.And as far as my penetrating intellect if I tell you to test me between 9 and 10 am and you come at 6 pm why the fuck would I think you are a drug tester and what is the point of the window if you come when you feel like it.And this bullshit was 4 years ago.She has won 7 grand slams in 4 years.They test her as much or more than anyone.Get a life.
You are an excitable little chap, aren't you? Why should it bother you what anyone else thinks about Serena? You could always choose not to come here. I guess you find criticism of your heroes unbearable. Just in case it's true.
You are a pussy who hides behind forums and the same way I choose to come here is the same way you could choose not to come here.That is right Serena is like my family even though she has no clue who I am but there are a million of us who feel just like I do.It is Serena's army just in case you don't know and we go through the wall for our girl and we are her defenders against people like you.
Serena has an "army of useful idiots", just as Lance Armstrong had an army of useful idiots that defended him. Both are brazen, obvious dopers, whose fans got angrier and angrier as it became more and more obvious what they were up to.
Tankhead, I come here because this is an anti-doping site and I detest the cheats in professional sport. You come here because your "girl" (weird!) is identified as one of them. You aren't going to change that. Hurts, don't it?
Who identified her? THE ITF or the douchebags on this site.
If the opinions of those on this site are of "douchebags" you would hardly bother to respond. But you are in a little rage because you are afraid what they say is true. You have made a hero out of a cheat. That must be very disillusioning for you.
Would explain why every single one of the numerous twitter posts from pros bemoaning drug testing all seem to reference an early hour. It must be a very commonly accepted time. Also, Serena's 'army'... LOL... I guess she needs one with the holes in her alibis.
richard,.I agree you are not a douchebag. You are just a front runner. You still haven't answered questions about physical signs of Serena's doping that you have listed about other players
He is no front runner,when you get to the front he hates you unless you are Sharapova.Listen Eric we both are Serena fans,he is not giving any proof only conjecture,dwelling on the panic room incident forever,she has been tested as much as anyone in the last few years after winning 7 slams in 4 years but you can't change a racist haters mind.If she passes the drug test she is masking you can't win with these people.Responding to jerkoffs like that is fruitless but we feel a need to defend Serena so we do but in reality she could give 2 fucks what they say or what we say.
Seren's strength, stamina, age, outlasting her former contemporaries with her long career, outlasting her ten-year-younger present day opponents in three setter after three setter, as well as foot injury lies and mysterious panic room episode, are all very very suspicious signs.
Who are Serena's contemporaries? Kim whose level drops to zero when she is not training 24hrs a day? or the known doper Henin who tears shoulder muscles when she is not doped up? One think the majority doesn't realize is that when you are playing against a much more stronger player, it takes a lot more energy to return the balls and a lot more running to return the heavy and fast balls. Serena doesn't do the majority of the running. She sends her opponents to go look for her balls. That is why she lost in Wimbledon her best surface because she faced someone who weigh the same and was powerful. I can't say she outlast her opponents first because 3sets is pretty short essentially if it involves Serena and second because When Serena loses a set, it is mainly because she is mishitting and not because she is being outplayed. So she doesn't lose a lot of energy in the lost sets.Learn the game and the dynamics of human body and you will understand.
> Who are Serena's contemporaries?Venus :) Clijsters, Henin, Davenport and Hingis. You could throw Capriati in there, though she started about 5 years earlier.> Serena doesn't do the majority of the running.That's probably true (against most opponents anyway). I would also add, in her favor, that she and Venus were known for skipping a lot of the smaller tournaments earlier in their careers and just focusing on majors. That no doubt reduced the total miles they had on their bodies.Still, it's fair to ask whether her strength compared to others is entirely genetic and not also the result of PEDs. Then there's the "panic room" incident, the pulmonary embolism, and her complete loss of motor control during a doubles match at Wimbledon. She's also had some major rage episodes on court, the most memorable being when she threatened a linesperson.
I don't understand why you guys keep coming up with that embolism argument. Look online and check the direct relation with foot surgery. Serena did have foot surgery right before that. If she has been doping since her childhood like you guys claim, why would the embolism occur only after her foot surgery? Do you still expect Davenport to be playing at 40 years old? How many majors did she win anyway? Do you expect Capriati and Hingis to still be playing with all the head issues they had in the past? Venus only plays tennis just to annoy those who are expecting them to retire and she is not healthy at this point of her career. Serena is the only player who has never lost her brute strength. Federer, Djokovic, Nadal, and others did in some of their matches. Even if we assume Serena dopes, I don't think she would dope every single match of her career and based on that we should have seen her loose her strength. But you have to agree with me that it never happened. Serena's body type is proportionate to her body type , muscles and weight. Kim did challenge Serena strength wise.Capriati also did. There is nothing that justify guys like Federer overpowering Tsonga with that difference in weightand height. I would understand if federer is taller. The same way there was no justification for Henin to have that kind of strength. As to the rage episode, whites are the most concerned. No blacks would tell you they are concerned. Blacks are not built girly girly. You see the ton of voices and everything. Blacks are built different. Have a ball. body make someone else lose a title ans you will see their reactions
Now do you see what I am saying?How many times does somebody have to lead you to water before you drink it?She is the greatest tennis player of all time period been better than everybody since she was a kid and happens to be black.Don't you think that annoys the lily white world of tennis? So they look to tear her down and discredit her.No amount of drugs can make you a champion.That comes from inside,the will to win.These are all white people posting their prejudice speculation but since they accuse everybody they get away with it.Everytime you question them they have only one answer,she is a doper.Been dealing with racism all my life and I am white with mixed children.Go to tennis.com that is where the real tennis fans are.
Dtank77, this is not a site for tennis fans but those who are concerned about doping. You clearly don't understand that.The arguments that Serena is a likely doper are not racial - but your defense is - because the players who generate the most discussion - Nadal and now Djokovic - are white. That notwithstanding, we see from names like Ben Johnson, Marion Jones and Barry Bonds that black athletes will also dope. Their "genetic" superiority is clearly not enough. We also saw that a generation of East Germans was better than anyone else in the 70's and 80's. They were of course dopers.Since this site became active 7 or 8 years ago Serena has been seen as one of the chief doping suspects in tennis, along with Nadal. We don't know if either has returned positive dope tests (but that doesn't necessarily tell us much because many of the biggest known dopers in the history of sport never failed a dope test). That amount of speculation of itself should tell you something, if you are at all concerned about doping in sports.However, Serena fans like you and Ed - he has been coming here for years - turn up from time to time to defend their hero. You convince no one, because you yourselves cannot consider any of the issues objectively and because over the years better arguments than yours have been made here that Serena has to be a prime doping suspect. Yes, you and Ed are indeed wasting your time. And ours.